User talk:Feldmahler/archive10

Gigout

Another question. How do you move files to a page that is already created? For instance, this file and this other one should be moved to this one. Sorry again...but knowing more allows me to collaborate more hehe. take care. NachoBA

You can simply copy and paste the file entry to the destination page :) --Feldmahler 13:55, 13 July 2007 (EDT)

Durey/U.S. Server

Hey Feldmahler, while doing the D's for the MIT project I came across this piece.

• Romance sans Paroles, Op.21 (Durey, Louis)

It is posted under the pre 1923 rule but seems to be hosted on the Canadian server instead of the U.S. one. Anyway, when you get around to linking all the files I've uploaded to the U.S. server over the last couple of days, you should probably fix this one as well.Mcroskell 00:13, 15 July 2007 (EDT)

All done :) --Feldmahler 00:26, 15 July 2007 (EDT)

selling downloaded music on Ebay

I recently found out that someone put most of my arrangements, off this site, onto a CD and is selling them for profit on Ebay. A lot of cello pieces on that CD are from this site. The ID of the person is "Cellopronet". I wrote the person that my arrangements are under copyright and are not to be distributed without my permisson, especially for profit. Item number: 130135757602 and 130135767453. I feel like I have the right to pursue legal action against this person for copyright infringment. There is also one bid on the first of the the two CDs. I also contacted Ebay and the bidder about the problem. If the problem persists, I will be pulling all of my arramgements off this site, I regret to say. Thank you, Yuriy. YuriyLcello 09:38, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

Hi YuriyLcello! I've looked at your submissions. I hate to say this, but I believe it is best to be frank here. The license you submitted the files under (CC-ND) does not prevent commercial exploitation of the work, which means that the eBayer is not actually infringing upon the copyright by selling the file. Also, the Creative Commons series of licenses is non-revokable, meaning that once a piece is licensed under one of the Creative Commons licenses it will always be licensed under that license, which would mean that I cannot even take the submissions off IMSLP (IMSLP has a removal policy of removing only copyright infringing material, and unfortunately does not run on good will; see this forum thread). What you really wanted was the CC-NC-ND license (non-commerical no derivatives).

Currently the only way you can sue the eBayer is if he/she either modifies the score or does not attribute you with the arrangement of the piece. The latter is actually possible, considering that the eBayer did not attribute you on the eBay page.

The only thing that I can say here is that you have unfortunately been bitten by the snake that is "copyright". From my knowledge most composers do run into trouble at some point or other with copyright, because they do not think enough about it. Remember next time to think thoroughly before licensing a piece under any license; it would be even better if you could read the actual legal code of the license.

Sorry! This is all I can do... :/ --Feldmahler 13:05, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

So you mean to say that I can't pull anything that has my name on it off this site? I could however sell my own versions on Ebay, in print form, since I don't believe in bootlegging. YuriyLcello 14:03, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

Well, the only thing that matters when pulling something off IMSLP is whether it is infringing copyright or not; nothing else is relevant. This may sound cold, but it is a necessary objectiveness to prevent the diminishing of the public domain, arbitrary changes in licensing, and any other good-will (towards the owner) based actions that will diminish the freedoms of the user.

Licensing is essentially a contract between the creator and the user; it spells out the conditions of use. Hence, as the creator, you are free to do whatever you want with the piece regardless of what license it is licensed under. In fact, you can license it under multiple licenses that cover different aspects (a common dual-licensing scheme is to have a free non-commercial license, and then a proprietary commercial license).

Hope this clarifies things! --Feldmahler 14:14, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

U.S. Server Again

Hey Feldmahler, just thought I'd give you a heads up that quite a few of the composers I've been doing the last few days for the MIT project have had works falling under the 1923 rule. As a result, the upload request page is starting to get a bit backlogged. So if you don't want to have too enormous of a task on your hands you might check it out when you get a chance before the list grows much longer (also, this will help to avoid the seemingly inevitable questions about why certain pieces don't appear on the U.S server!). Also, Jujimufu uploaded a Langgard file which does fit the requirements for the 1923 rule. However the file he uploaded also contained a preface from 1995 that was not removed, so I took the liberty of reuploading a version with the copyrighted material removed (Langgaard Blumenvignetten V2.pdf]], thus make sure to use this one. Thanks for all your work on this site.Mcroskell 04:13, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

Done! :) By the way, there seems to be one Ketelbey file on the US server that isn't submitted to the wiki (Elgar Express)...

Also, thanks for the Langgard correction! I've moved the v2 file to the old name because that name is the one on the wiki :) --Feldmahler 05:17, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

Thanks for the quick work Feldmahler. As for the Ketelbey file you are talking about, it is actually a transcription of Elgar's Op.78. I put the link to it at The Starlight Express, Op.78 (Elgar, Edward) and put in the misc. notes section that it is located in the Ketelbey folder on the U.S. server. Is this all right? I always get a little bit confused over the protocol for uploading transcriptions. For people who are really well known for their transcriptions and who often take great artistic liberties with them (i.e. Liszt, Friedman, Godowsky, etc. I'll usually put the transcription on their page since it seems to me that would be where most people would look for them, but for most other straightforward transcriptions or really obscure transcribers I put it onto the original composers page under the work that is being transcribed). Do we have a hard and fast rule yet on exactly how we handle transcriptions?Mcroskell 05:23, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

Transcriptions are really very hard to handle. The most bulletproof way is to submit duplicate entries under both the original composer and arranger. Previously I left open the option of submission under only the original composer (this option is still open as of current policy), because some arrangers adhere strictly to the composer's intentions, and are not generally known in themselves as notable "arrangers". However, I understand that this distinction is very much arbitrary, so I may follow Sibley's lead, and just require all arrangements to be submitted to both composer and arranger. I will think a bit more about it and change the policy page when I come to a decision. In the meanwhile, I think you can never go wrong with duplicate submissions, especially when the arranger is well known :) --Feldmahler 05:31, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

Composer Periods

I was thinking that maybe we should created one more period for composers.

Instead of using the term "Modern" for anything that was written after 1945, I think we should define the term "Contemporary". The word "Modern" is often associated with the Modernist movement. Taken from wikipedia, "Postmodernism in music and literature began to take hold even earlier, some say by the 1950s." So, the actual "modernist" movement in music was finished by the, say, 60's. For example, I wouldn't consider Stockhausen to be Modern, but rather Contemporary. Maybe we should define a category for composers who are still alive (and thus their works are on IMSLP with their consent and having released their works under the appropriate licenses, of course) and for composers who only died recently (e.g. Messiaen, John Cage etc).

It's just an idea, though. It's just fine like it is now, I just feel like "modern" refers to something in the past now, while "contemporary" is more up-to-date, if I can say it that way. So, what do you think? :P Maybe we should have a discussion about the borderline between Modern and Contemporary.

~ jujimufu 09:22, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

Well, this seems more to be a semantic issue at the moment, if I understand correctly (i.e. you are suggesting to replace the name "modern" with "contemporary"). This will probably have to wait until after August (and all the upgrade/server moving stuff). You can, however, open a forum thread about it and discuss this in the meanwhile. :) --Feldmahler 13:22, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

Emailing Other Users

Hello Feldmahler, I was wondering if it is possible to send emails to users through the main site (I realize it can be done throough the forums). In "My Preferences" I see the option that you can enable to allow email from other users and I have this checked; however I don't see an option on my profile page anywhere to send me an email nor have I seen it on anyone else's page. Am I just being blind and missing it or is this not something that the site is able to do? Thanks, Mcroskell 02:01, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

Actually it's really simple; just click the "E-mail this user" link in the toolbox section of the sidebar. :) --Feldmahler 02:43, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

Wow, can't believe I missed that. I looked all over the main page but for some reason it never occurred to me to look in the toolbar. Thanks!

Living Composers

Hi Feldmahler, just an idea: Would you (or anyone) like to create a page for works of new composers that set their own works as PD? Just to help them getting famous? Maybe there are some volunteers offering their compositions.

You know, this is not a bad idea at all. Maybe you can try creating the page? :) --Feldmahler 13:23, 30 July 2007 (EDT)

Sorry I dont have the basic knowledge for this. I would have done this if I could. I'll try to visit some courses for webdesign next semestre ;-) There are surely some faster users here. (Ahandrich 06:27, 31 July 2007 (EDT))

No knowledge in webdesign required, just a few minutes to read the first two (short) pages of the Tutorial and you're ready to start. --Leonard Vertighel 06:47, 31 July 2007 (EDT)

Thanks a lot, I have already read it. Living Composers, Increasing Fame, Talented Newcomers, Getting A Famous Composer or Composers Newest Works sound a bit strange. It needs some creativity for this. I (or better someone else) need(s) some feedback. The certain composers could click on a symbol that confirms their statement for each new work (on the uploading page). Then a new list, installed on "specialsites", like the "new files list" on the mainpage is required, with any limited capacity. But how to implement this? Thats a bit more than only editing a new page?! Ahandrich 08:25, 31 July 2007 (EDT)

I would suggest starting a forum thread about this asking for opinions :) I unfortunately cannot help as I will be very busy for the next few days. --Feldmahler 15:03, 31 July 2007 (EDT)

LoC Music collections call numbers

Feldmaher, I haven't forgotten about the cataloge I promised. Here's what has happened: Apparently, at least according to our library online cataloge, we have 2 copies of this index for the M and MLs, one supposedly on the shelf and the other at an off-campus location called the repository which is basically an overflow for less-used materials. The one supposedly on the shelf was nowhere to be found, and I even put out a search request for this with no luck, so I initiated a recall of the one held at the repository only to find out that they also couldn't find it, so long story made short I WILL get a copy of this and scan it, but I'll have to wait until I'm situated at my new university first. Remind me in a month or so if I don't get back with you on this. Apologies!Daphnis 23:14, 30 July 2007 (EDT)

Ah... don't worry about it at all :) There are no deadlines for the implementation of this catalog system, and above all I don't want you to get stressed out about this :) --Feldmahler 15:03, 31 July 2007 (EDT)

Ok good news finally. I got my hands on the newest edition of the Classification index (1998). The section of interest to us is the M (just music), but over half of those entries are taken up by vocal music, so I ask you--what would you prefer to have? The whole M section or certain sections within the M, namely instrumental? Daphnis 21:41, 29 August 2007 (EDT)

Merging Pages

Hi Feldmahler, I'm working on uploading all the pieces for Godowsky from the MIT project (which believe me is turning out to be quite the mammoth task). His composer page is starting to get pretty cluttered up with transcriptions, so I thought about trying to at least consolidate the transcriptions by composer like I did when uploading Friedman's transcriptions (i.e. Piano Transcriptions-Chopin, Piano Transcriptions-Strauss, etc.). However, many of them have already been uploaded all onto separate pages. Is there any way for me to merge these pages into one page and then give it a new name, or do I have to simply create the new page that I want and then copy all the file info over to it and then have the old pages deleted? I appreciate any advice you can give me on this matter, Mcroskell 02:23, 1 August 2007 (EDT)

Sorry for the late reply! I was away yesterday. The easiest way currently to do this is the second way you said. Basically, you will have to create the page and move each file entry to the new page. While technically you can use the add file form for this, it is probably a better idea (and easier) to just manually copy and paste the file entries to the new page. :) --Feldmahler 00:14, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

Public domain question

Heya there again!

I have a question about public domain. If, for example, a composer died in 1951 (and thus is public domain in Canada), but a work of his was published after 1956 (say, 1960), can we upload it on IMSLP or not?

Hi Jujimufu! Unfortunately no, Canadian copyright law protects posthumous publications for a period of publication+50 years. Hence, that work would be public domain in 2011. --Feldmahler 12:28, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

I see. Ok, thanks :P

Btw, I am going to order a few books from amazon, and I was thinking if you have to suggest any books you think are worth reading (concerning composition - aren't you studying composition? If you are not, then ignore the rest of the note, lol :P). I am currently thinking about Smith Brindle's "Serial Composition", or Schoenberg's "Structural functions of harmony", and I would generally like books concerning more contemporary techniques. I already have books on counterpoint (J. Fux's "Study of Counterpoint"), harmony (Tchaikovsky's "Guide to the study of harmony"), orchestration (Sam Adler's "Study of Orchestration") and composition (Schoenberg's "Fundamentals of Musical Composition"). Any ideas would be appreciated :P Take care! ~ jujimufu 17:46, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

Hmm... I'm not familiar with Brindle's book (actually I haven't really studied serial composition much; I have rather mixed feelings about serialism in general). Schoenberg's harmony book is something interesting to read; I remember reading it a few years ago, and still remember that it wasn't like any other harmony book haha. I don't remember too much in detail about it, but I won't treat it like a normal harmony book in any case; remember that Schoenberg is the guy who said that to compose you must forget everything that came before (a student of his came to our conservatory and gave a talk about this). I could recommend reading that book (it is certainly a fun read if nothing else), but to a certain point I'd suggest more that you just follow whichever book that your conservatory chose as the textbook. I say this because teaching (and learning) music is in my opinion a very interactive process; it is something that cannot be learned entirely from books. In fact, some of the better courses I've taken had no textbook. I mean, if you are going to learn from books, then you won't need to go to a conservatory now would you ;) This is of course not to deny other qualities of music books; in particular those books give great insight as to the compositional practice of the period they were written in, but I won't depend too much on them for actually learning composition. I would more recommend just composing lots, and analyzing the scores of masters (and try to figure out why they are so good). And of course just familiarizing yourself with a large repertory of music is always a good idea.

To be honest I haven't read too many music books myself, but I consider myself blessed with some very good teachers, so it doesn't matter :) However, one of the book types that I *would* recommend you read are music history books and composer biographies. I know people who find much inspiration in reading them (and I personally used to read a lot of those too... too bad I don't have time nowadays anymore). --Feldmahler 00:52, 4 August 2007 (EDT)

What exactly happened with these two pages?

There's something wrong here:

• (No Title) (Antheil, George Carl Johann)
• Homage to Handel, Op.75(II) (Karg-Elert, Sigfrid)

Thanks --Leonard Vertighel 13:32, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

Thanks for reporting this! This is actually a bug in the title splitting regex; it fails to match on titles with a parenthesis with no preceding space. I'll fix this either tonight or tomorrow, along with a few feature implementations. :) In the meanwhile I've moved the pages to titles that do not break it. --Feldmahler 14:05, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

Picture Format & Page Error

Hi Feldmahler, I was trying to add a composer picture using the new format to Gruenfeldt's page but it doesn't seem to be showing up. With the new system does it simply take a while before the picture will appear or have I done something wrong? I used the new way to add the picture to Gretchaninov's page last night but for some reason it doesn't seem to be working for me today and I can't see what I've done differently.

Also, speaking of Gretchaninov, somehow a link for the Publisher Schott that should appear on the historical publishing info page is instead showing up on Gretchaninov's page under G. I have no idea how this might have happened or what to do to fix it so you might want to go take a look at it here. Thanks.Mcroskell 13:35, 8 August 2007 (EDT)

The page seems fine to me (the picture shows up as normal). Normally the page cache should have been purged on edit, but it may be that somehow your browser is serving up a cached version of the page. Next time you can try to manually purge the cache (and your browser cache of the page) by adding "&action=purge" to the end of the URL. :) This time I've manually purged the page already, so it should be fine even for you. If left alone the cache will automatically purge after 3 days.

The Schott issue is because Peter forgot to add a colon (:) to the beginning of the category link. I've fixed it :) --Feldmahler 13:59, 8 August 2007 (EDT)

Well, that is strange. I went back and looked and the picture of Gruenfeldt still won't show up for me even after I tried purging the cache. However, if you say it is up then I guess it is not really a problem.Mcroskell 15:37, 8 August 2007 (EDT)

I see what the problem is. I had been looking at Gretchaninov's composer page instead of Gruenfeldt's haha. Basically, the Composer template hadn't been modified to accommodate the new entries (it worked fine for other pages because they used #imslpcomposer: directly and not the Composer template). In any case this is now fixed :) --Feldmahler 17:11, 8 August 2007 (EDT)